Good post and excellent scriptural reasoning. Some great points made there.
Must obey!
JoinedPosts by Must obey!
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The "generation" cover-up continues
by proplog2 inwell, the new "generation" light has finally been released in print.
this is important because it the centerpiece of their whole orientation.. it is still a disjointed coverup of why they have this doctrine in the first place.
christ didn't come in 1874 or 1914. .
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144 000 blasted by the MATH (WT lying again)
by hamsterbait ini just took nathan natas chart for numbers of memorial partakers since 1935.. i worked out that on average 823 new partakers have been added every year since 1936, whilst on average 716 have been dying each year.. what is especially interesting, is that when the total of new partaker numbers almost exactly matches that given in w96 15/8 p31 for 1935, is in the year 1995 - they year they began to deliberately create the fog around the "generation" teaching.
(i used actual figures, not averages here).
i am now convinced that they have been paving the way for the feb 15 noolite since then.. i disregarded the figure for 1935 itself, since the witchtower gives two figures for partakers -.
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Must obey!
This is amazing but it rests on the assumption that 5% have been dying each year. That does seem pretty high. I would like to see the figures based on only a 2% death rate.
And why only go back to 1935? What about all the partakers from 1879 (first Watchtower ever) to 1935? There were thousands then too.
If Jesus looked down on the Bible Students in 1914-19 and decided they were good enough to bestow the honour of being his only true organisation upon, then they must be good enough for him since right up to now! So you can add all the Bible Students since 1919 also!
The Society must surely know that the numbers game is up...the 144k figure has long since been exceeded! They have all the stats on this...they must know it!
They will eventually have no choice but to make the 144k a symbolic number as more JW's notice this.
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What makes the 144,000 heavenly class stand out from the average person?
by RULES & REGULATIONS inthe jehovahs witnesses claim that the 144,000 is a limit to the number of people who will reign with christ in heaven and spend eternity with god.
the 144,000 have the heavenly hope.
those who are not born again will enjoy the earthly hopea paradise on earth ruled by christ and the 144,000. today,the wts claim that there are less than 9,000 heavenly class left on earth.. .
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Must obey!
One reason we know that the 'heavenly class' concept is a bit of a sham is that the remnant (ones alive on earth today) are all totally and utterly blindly following the Watchtower Society, in fear of the GB and worshipping the GB idol, just like anyone else of the great crowd class. They are not Christ-centred and certainly not 'noble-minded' like the Boreans because they are in fear of critiquing and examining what they are being taught by the WTS, therefore the holy spirit is clearly not operating on their minds. They are just brainwashed Watchtowerites swallowing everything pumped out by the Watchtower Writing Department unquestioningly like anyone of the earthly class.
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Is an Organization required?
by Robert7 inso i had a shepherding call recently, and i laid out my concerns to the elders.
i said how can put full faith and trust into jehovah's organization, one which is directed by holy spirit, even though its past is littered with issues and errors (new light)?
i mentioned the redefining of generation, 1975 issue, and the un involvement.
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Must obey!
No an 'organisation' is not required, but the scriptures are clear that a 'congregation' is. A congregation can be a very small number, as little as 2 or 3, and Christ can be there. Either way, there is nothing in the NT to say we can just 'go it alone' I'm afraid.
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So, some of you know i was in a
by orbison11 invery nasty relationship, for 8 years.
about 14 days ago, i was finally able to find place to live with my dear pup:).
today i went to get my last load from the house,,,,,he was gone,,,,,but what do i find on his dresser???
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Must obey!
That was a pretty psycho thing to do. See what you mean when you say you have issues.
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144 000 blasted by the MATH (WT lying again)
by hamsterbait ini just took nathan natas chart for numbers of memorial partakers since 1935.. i worked out that on average 823 new partakers have been added every year since 1936, whilst on average 716 have been dying each year.. what is especially interesting, is that when the total of new partaker numbers almost exactly matches that given in w96 15/8 p31 for 1935, is in the year 1995 - they year they began to deliberately create the fog around the "generation" teaching.
(i used actual figures, not averages here).
i am now convinced that they have been paving the way for the feb 15 noolite since then.. i disregarded the figure for 1935 itself, since the witchtower gives two figures for partakers -.
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Must obey!
Fascinating! However, I didn't understand what you meant in the third paragraph. Also don't quite understand what you mean by 'equality' date? Can you explain a bit more clearly, as this looks very interesting and potentially quite damaging to the Society's 144k literalness claim?
Are you saying that using the Society's own officially reported stats, since 1935 there have been a minimum of 112,000 NEW partakers? WOW!
& please, where are these figures worked out by Nathan Natas you refer to?
Thanks for this research
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Scriptural Christian requirements v JW Christian requirements
by Must obey! inthe scriptural requirements to be a good christian are refreshingly few and simple, perhaps encapsulated by these few scriptures (nwt):.
matthew 7:12 all things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must likewise do to them; this, in fact, is what the law and the prophets mean.
1 john 3:16 for god loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.. acts 15:28 for the holy spirit and we ourselves have favored adding no further burden to you, except these necessary things, 29 to keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication.
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Must obey!
Thanks Sad Emo
Others: If you're not even interested in religion or don't believe in the bible then why bother even reading this thread. Why even bother with this website?
Wizard, JW's can wear any colour shirt they want on FS (except something obnoxiously garish)...where on earth did you hear that the brothers must only wear white shirts?
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could it be a coincidence?
by XOCO ini know that i don't created a lot of topics but i've been thinking about my feelings towards jw teachings and what i have learned so far from jwd and a couple of other sites.
i always found it hard 2 dismiss what i have learned from the kh and on apostate sites i feel like i'm in a cognitive dissonance, which means uncomfortable tension that may result from having two conflicting thoughts at the same time.
video: hovah means mischief .
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Must obey!
The cognitive dissonance you are feeling is natural and healthy, but don't fall into the trap of seeing everything as black and white. JW's see a black and white world and it is a mistake of taking that same faulty thinking into your ex-JW life. It is not a matter of rejecting everything you learnt as a JW. The JW's teach some good, true doctrines IMHO but also teach much crap. Learn to keep what you feel is true and right and reject what is bollox. Be discerning & selective, not extreme. Good luck in your journey
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Scriptural Christian requirements v JW Christian requirements
by Must obey! inthe scriptural requirements to be a good christian are refreshingly few and simple, perhaps encapsulated by these few scriptures (nwt):.
matthew 7:12 all things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must likewise do to them; this, in fact, is what the law and the prophets mean.
1 john 3:16 for god loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.. acts 15:28 for the holy spirit and we ourselves have favored adding no further burden to you, except these necessary things, 29 to keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication.
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Must obey!
The scriptural requirements to be a good Christian are refreshingly few and simple, perhaps encapsulated by these few scriptures (NWT):
Matthew 7:12 “All things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must likewise do to them; this, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean.
1 John 3:16 “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.”
Acts 15:28 “For the holy spirit and we ourselves have favored adding no further burden to you, except these necessary things, 29 to keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols and from blood and from things strangled and from fornication. If you carefully keep yourselves from these things, you will prosper. Good health to you!”
Romans 10:9 “For if you publicly declare that ‘word in your own mouth,’ that Jesus is Lord, and exercise faith in your heart that God raised him up from the dead, you will be saved.”
Romans 13:8 “Do not you people be owing anybody a single thing, except to love one another; for he that loves his fellowman has fulfilled [the] law. 9 For the [law code], “You must not commit adultery, You must not murder, You must not steal, You must not covet,” and whatever other commandment there is, is summed up in this word, namely, “You must love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does not work evil to one’s neighbor; therefore love is the law’s fulfillment.”
1 Cor 6:9 “What! Do you not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men, 10 nor thieves, nor greedy persons, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit God’s kingdom.”
1 Cor 15:3 “For I handed on to you, among the first things, that which I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures; 4 and that he was buried, yes, that he has been raised up the third day according to the Scriptures; 5 and that he appeared to Ce´phas, then to the twelve. 6 After that he appeared to upward of five hundred brothers at one time,…”
James 1:27 “The form of worship that is clean and undefiled from the standpoint of our God and Father is this: to look after orphans and widows in their tribulation, and to keep oneself without spot from the world.”
1 John 5:1 “Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born from God, and everyone who loves the one that caused to be born loves him who has been born from that one. 2 By this we gain the knowledge that we are loving the children of God, when we are loving God and doing his commandments. 3 For this is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments..”
There are no convoluted creeds, chronologies, forced and fanciful prophetic speculations and strained interpretations, no harsh, legalistic, nit-picking policies, rules and regulations. There is no emphasis on slavish works, organisations, centralised control structures, heirarchies. There is just a very simple template of belief in Jesus Christ and his resurrection and obedience to Christ's commands for living a good, clean, moral life revolving around faith and love for others.
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NOW, Compare that simple framework with the Watchtower Society’s authoritarian, legalistic, prescriptive approach:
"Q: Why have Jehovah's Witnesses disfellowshipped for apostasy some who still profess belief in God, the Bible and Jesus Christ? A:
Approved association with Jehovah's Witnesses requires accepting the entire range of the true teachings of the Bible, including those scriptural beliefs that are unique to Jehovah's Witnesses. What do such beliefs include? ...That 1914 marked the end of the Gentile Times and the establishment of the Kingdom of God in the heavens, as well as the time for Christ's foretold presence." (Watchtower, Question From Readers, April 1, 1986 pp 30-31)Do you see anything wrong with this picture?
Yes, The Watchtower Society has gone far beyond the simple, scriptural template/framework for what a Christian must necessarily believe in and practice to have God’s favour and to enjoy the right to wholesome association with fellow Christians
The Watchtower Society needs to drastically rationalise (reduce) the body of doctrine that it dogmatically insists all JW's must profess and accept; they need to bring their thinking back in line with the simple pattern of primitive Christianity and eliminate everything that is not absolutely clearly expressed in scripture. Until they do that, they are going beyond the "good news" the apostles & Paul established (Gal 1:8 & 9). They are presently burdening JW's with a whole range of debateable creeds and traditions that go far beyond the "necessary things" that Jesus and the apostles and the holy spirit regarded as necessary for Christians to adhere to. Until they get back to original Christianity they can find no favour with Jesus Christ.
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Australian Government Porn Filter To Slow Down the Internet
by What-A-Coincidence inhttp://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22989008-661,00.html.
australians will be forced to contact their internet service provider to avoid having their access to the web restricted.. .
the restrictions are planned by the federal government to give greater protection to children from online pornography and violent websites.. .
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Must obey!
What a great idea and great news. This is a balanced approach, despite what the bleeding heart liberals will cry!
With all the filth awash on the internet I will never let my 7 year old daughter near a computer unsupervised. More needs to be done like this to help stem rampant paedophilia & other abuses that the internet is spawning. It needs to be tilted more conservatively and hooray for Australia for having the guts to do it.